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I understand it's important to protect fighters to a certain extent if you're a promoter so you can capitalize the most on them. The question I have is if anyone is to take Pavlik seriously, we have to see him face quality opponents. Hopkins beat him badly, so I can understand a confidence building come back fight but having a string of very weak opposition makes you wonder if he's just all hype at this point. Having a loyal fan base is nice and all, but at what point do they keep paying to watch this guy?
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Re: Kelly Pavlik's opponents
Jun 18, 2009 3:05 PM
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You should have some kind of sympathy even though he'd probably tell you not to pity him. The thing is people turn to alcohol and drugs mainly thru deep depressions-sometime thru 2 much partying-but 2 much alcohol kills and destroy lives. The good thing is Kelly is doing the right thing by getting help and I pray to god he comes out of this all right.
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Re: Kelly Pavlik's opponents
Jun 17, 2009 6:26 PM
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> Kelly Pavlik enrolled into rehab due to a drinking
> problem. Alcohol addiction is far worse then any
> opponent he's ever faced in the ring and I pray he
> get's his victory.
Well that's just great. Lew Jenkins might have
been one of the all time great lightweights if
he hadn't become a full time drunk.
No sympathy....I've always been too busy trying
to survive to become a drunk.
--
http://therealnews.com/t/
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Re: Kelly Pavlik's opponents
Jun 17, 2009 5:03 PM
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Kelly Pavlik enrolled into rehab due to a drinking problem. Alcohol addiction is far worse then any opponent he's ever faced in the ring and I pray he get's his victory.
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Re: Kelly Pavlik's opponents
Jun 11, 2009 3:59 PM
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If Kelly fights Sturm in the fall and then fight Froch early January then I'll be 1 of the 1st one's giving him major props. I really wanted to see him fight Abraham but I wont complain about Sturm in the fall and Froch in Jan not 1 bit.
He doesn't even have to fight them back to back-he could fight Sturm then a Mudine but damn he's tryn to go from Sturm then Froch-much respect. HBO and Showtime need to pick up both Abraham and Sturm so the fans can see what these guys really have-put them on a undercard or something the fans need to see these fighters.
I don't know who would win vs Abraham and Pav-but we do know both fighters have alot of heart-I think both would knock P.Williams out-I'm talking sleepy time out. Sturm could possibly out box him-maybe. Yall seem to 4get that P.Will was clearly outboxed by Quintana damn the rematch-it was only a rematch cause Paul was outboxed-kind of schooled if you ask me. Much respect to Pavlik though.
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Re: Kelly Pavlik's opponents
Jun 2, 2009 3:28 AM
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Its not about the money, his first bout with Green pocketed him over $5 million. Large sum, considering Tarver didn't even get a million for the rematch with Dawson.
He also holds a record in boxing. In that hes the only fighter ever to have everyone of his fights on PPV.
In short, he believes hes in their with a big chance of beating Kelly. Hes a legit number 3 in the division, ahead of Sturm.
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Re: Kelly Pavlik's opponents
Jun 2, 2009 12:48 AM
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Mundine wants to get paid. No shame in that. Hes even willing to commit suicide to get there. Gotta love a guy like that. 
--
"What good are eyes if the mind is blind?" - Arab proverb
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Re: Kelly Pavlik's opponents
Jun 1, 2009 12:16 PM
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> When we use the term cleaning out the division we act
> as though it has to take years to do. See shit like
> that still matters to me-1 of the problems with
> boxing is how they trick the fans into believing all
> the hype about some super fight.
>
> Guys move up in weight fighting taylor made guys-the
> e average fan that think they know but really doesn't
> know eats this shit up. IMO-defeating a couple of
> champs in your division is harder than these so
> called super fights.
>
> I mean who doesn't love a super fight-but defeating
> g a champ or 2 before gunning for a super fight is
> the shit to me. I'm tired of these super fights to a
> point-there's a number 1 contender constantly getting
> screwed because of this shit. Guys just keep moving
> up taking on David Diaz type champions and it's okay.
>
>
> I say once they move up-they should stay long enough
> to @least fight another champ before moving up or
> down for another so called super fight. I don't care
> what anyone says on here-Abraham and Sturm are proven
> MW champions-their taking the tougher
> challenges-while Pav gets all the stay bizzy fights.
> Abraham came to America and fought the rematch
> h basically on Miranda'a terms and tore that ass up.
>
> Sturm-say what you want about the guy-but he gets
> ts knocked out then comes back and do his thing-he
> had another tough fight either a draw or split and
> comes back and does his thing-all Pav is doing is
> milking the title. His next opponent should be 1 of
> the 2 champs calling him out and that's either Sturm
> or Abraham. You'll be surprized how many fans still
> prefer a dominant champ
I hear ya mannmann, but this is the reason I prefer The Ring title, as opposed to the ABC organizations. One champ per division. That's the way it used to be, and that's the way it should be now. I'm glad you brought up David Diaz. Pac moving up and beating him doesn't mean a whole lot to me. Just like the belt he held at 122 doesn't mean a whole lot to me. The fact is, when Pac was at 122, Paulie Ayala was The Ring champ. When Pac went to lightweight for a fight, Casamayor was The Ring champ. Since he never took on the established champ in those divisions, personally I don't consider him a "champ" in those divisions.
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Re: Kelly Pavlik's opponents
Jun 1, 2009 8:26 AM
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Mundine will take over Geales rankings. Have a look at who holds the IBO belts, theres great fighters. Manny, Bika, Dawson.
Mundine is probably the 2nd quickest fighter in the sport today behind Dawson, for middleweight and above.
He can fight, hes a character. Lets get this fight on.
Fireworks.
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Re: Kelly Pavlik's opponents
Jun 1, 2009 2:49 AM
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OK A little update here along with some
Mundine / Geale highlights....courtesy of tszyunami.
The guy doesn't look entirely easy to hit in that
particular fight.
I notice that Daniel Geale is still rated # 10
at the "Ring" and Mundine is not rated at 160
but is #5 at 168 lbs.
Mundine is not on the radar at the WBC or WBO
(The sanctioning bodies that Kelly holds titles with)
Mundine is #1 at the WBA....Where Felix Sturm
holds the title.
Sergio Mora is actually rated #6 at the WBC
and #10 at the WBO at 160. I don't know how
long he's been rated there. (Or how long he
will be) Sergio is rightfully rated #6 at 154 lbs
in the "Ring Magazine" ratings.
I like a Mundine defense / unification (if you consider
the IBO a sanctioning body) so long as Abraham is next
but Sturm might be where Mundine is aiming for now.
He does mention Pavlik as possible next fight in this video interview
However: After watching Kessler / Mundine
I notice that those double jabs and straight rights
from a taller fighter work to effect on Mundine.
Mundine also catches an aggressive Kessler
with left hooks from time to time.
I'm thinking that Kelly at 160 hits considerably
harder than Kessler does at 168.
I also think that tall fighters aren't Mundine's
most favorable opponents.
I see fireworks with an earlier KO than I thought
before with guess who winning....Maybe knockdowns
both ways.
I think this guy makes an exciting fight and Mora
just makes Kelly look bad, lol.... I think either Arum or
someone in Kelly's camp is making pretty good
"adjustments" himself if they make this fight instead
of Mora.
Mundine seemed to be doing well in his first world
title fight for IBF super middleweight title before
Sven Ottke clocked him perfectly in one of his six
career KOs. His other two losses were both by
decision in WBA World super middleweight title
fights (which he finally won) I don't know why
they pulled his title but his last loss was the
decision to Kessler.
--
http://therealnews.com/t/
--
Edited by JimEarl at 06/01/2009 1:58 AM PDT
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Re: Kelly Pavlik's opponents
May 31, 2009 8:15 PM
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When we use the term cleaning out the division we act as though it has to take years to do. See shit like that still matters to me-1 of the problems with boxing is how they trick the fans into believing all the hype about some super fight.
Guys move up in weight fighting taylor made guys-the average fan that think they know but really doesn't know eats this shit up. IMO-defeating a couple of champs in your division is harder than these so called super fights.
I mean who doesn't love a super fight-but defeating a champ or 2 before gunning for a super fight is the shit to me. I'm tired of these super fights to a point-there's a number 1 contender constantly getting screwed because of this shit. Guys just keep moving up taking on David Diaz type champions and it's okay.
I say once they move up-they should stay long enough to @least fight another champ before moving up or down for another so called super fight. I don't care what anyone says on here-Abraham and Sturm are proven MW champions-their taking the tougher challenges-while Pav gets all the stay bizzy fights. Abraham came to America and fought the rematch basically on Miranda'a terms and tore that ass up.
Sturm-say what you want about the guy-but he gets knocked out then comes back and do his thing-he had another tough fight either a draw or split and comes back and does his thing-all Pav is doing is milking the title. His next opponent should be 1 of the 2 champs calling him out and that's either Sturm or Abraham. You'll be surprized how many fans still prefer a dominant champ
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Re: Kelly Pavlik's opponents
May 31, 2009 5:39 PM
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> Hitking, well-put BUT one could also argue that the
> pt. you make is also what has hurt boxing. Onlike
> other sports, including MMA, there are too many
> champions...fighting the best and dominating/becoming
> a unified champ, fighting the best in your weight
> range also creates compelling fights (of the year
> perhaps) - garnering more ESPN or Yahoo.com
> attention, etc. I still think there are conventional
> ways to become stars and build credentials...but
> everyone, i.e. the promoters, are out for the
> quickest, easiest path to riches...and it's hurt the
> sport (but I agree, there is also no incentive for
> fighters to take on their peer challenges like it
> used to be). Maybe there is hope, when you see an HBO
> "force" Chad Dawson to fight Glen Johnson, et al.
> Keep hope alive!
>
> --
> http://www.fightinsight.com/2009/05/17/wake-me-when-it
> -is-over-chagaev-and-valuev-meet-again/
>
> http://www.fightinsight.com/2009/05/24/on-the-surface-
> juan-urango-is-a-good-test-for-andre-berto/
>
> http://www.fightinsight.com/2009/05/24/cotto-invites-c
> lottey-to-his-annual-madison-square-garden-party/
Well ja, that's why the boxing media needs to embrace The Ring's Championship Policy more than they already do. ESPN endorses The Ring's ratings. HBO announces fighters as The Ring champions before fights. And your right, HBO forced Chad Dawson to rematch Glen Johnson. Which in turn basically forced him to vacate his IBF belt. That being said, Showtime still treats the ABC organizations like they are the tell all in boxing. And although ESPN and HBo endorse The Ring, they still ackowledge the ABC organizations when its in the best interest of helping a promotion. Therefore, there is no way the ABC organizations will completely go away. Thats' why I feel the P4P ratings and superfights are a lot more improtant than cleaning out a respective division. A lot of casual fans know the ABC organizations are a joke, so whoever the respective "champion" in a given division has almost become irrelevant. If you don't watch boxing closely, The Ring title doesn't mean any more to you than the WBO title. All of them are a joke. That's why I prefer all the P4P elites fighting each other, opposed to cleaning out a division. Dominating a division just doesn't mean as much as it used to.
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Re: Kelly Pavlik's opponents
May 31, 2009 5:20 PM
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> > Let's just say that I've always known standup
> one -
> > two
> > fighters to have trouble with slick boxers at
> their
> > best.
> > Even ones with vicious left hooks such as Li'l
> Red
> > Lopez.
> >
> > When I finally watched Hopkins / Tarver a few
> days
> > before that fight I shut my mouth in here
> because
> > I feared his camp didn't have their hats on
> straight
> >
> > for making that fight. Even before that I didn't
> like
> >
> > the way Kelly looked at 168. I liked him fine
> at
> > 160.
> >
> > We're missing good fights right here in the
> > middleweight division simply because Kelly's
> camp
> > has been screwing around with their shortcut to
>
> > a legacy while good Middleweights like Abraham
> > don't get fought. Abraham might well grow out
> > of the division without being fought by Pavlik
> if
> > they don't make that fight by years end.
> >
> > Pavlik / Hopkins was a shutout even if a
> showcase
> > for Bernard at his best. There are better
> contests
> > to be seen at middleweight......we just haven't
>
> > seen them.
> >
> > --
> > http://therealnews.com/t/
> >
> > --
> > Edited by JimEarl at 05/31/2009 10:11 AM PDT
>
> I think your missing my point Jim. In the past
> decade or two, boxing has fallen out of the
> mainstream's eyesight. Now, MMA has become
> successful, even less people care about boxing.
> While defending a title is a good thing, its not
> t what gets casual fans excited. Kelly Pavlik could
> have fought Abraham, Sturm, and every other
> middleweight contender out there, and he probably
> wouldn't have even made SportsCenter. By fighting
> B-Hop, he got his name out there in there. Had he
> been successful, I'm sure he could have gotten
> another siperfight with Calzage, and he would have
> become a star in a sport that starving for stars.
> Pavlik has his entire career to defend the
> e middleweight title, but he only had a small window
> of time to become a star. He failed, and now he
> still has his title to lean on. I have no problem
> with that.
Hitking, well-put BUT one could also argue that the pt. you make is also what has hurt boxing. Onlike other sports, including MMA, there are too many champions...fighting the best and dominating/becoming a unified champ, fighting the best in your weight range also creates compelling fights (of the year perhaps) - garnering more ESPN or Yahoo.com attention, etc. I still think there are conventional ways to become stars and build credentials...but everyone, i.e. the promoters, are out for the quickest, easiest path to riches...and it's hurt the sport (but I agree, there is also no incentive for fighters to take on their peer challenges like it used to be). Maybe there is hope, when you see an HBO "force" Chad Dawson to fight Glen Johnson, et al. Keep hope alive!
--
http://www.fightinsight.com/2009/05/17/wake-me-when-it-is-over-chagaev-and-valuev-meet-again/
http://www.fightinsight.com/2009/05/24/on-the-surface-juan-urango-is-a-good-test-for-andre-berto/
http://www.fightinsight.com/2009/05/24/cotto-invites-clottey-to-his-annual-madison-square-garden-party/
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Re: Kelly Pavlik's opponents
May 31, 2009 2:00 PM
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> Let's just say that I've always known standup one -
> two
> fighters to have trouble with slick boxers at their
> best.
> Even ones with vicious left hooks such as Li'l Red
> Lopez.
>
> When I finally watched Hopkins / Tarver a few days
> before that fight I shut my mouth in here because
> I feared his camp didn't have their hats on straight
>
> for making that fight. Even before that I didn't like
>
> the way Kelly looked at 168. I liked him fine at
> 160.
>
> We're missing good fights right here in the
> middleweight division simply because Kelly's camp
> has been screwing around with their shortcut to
> a legacy while good Middleweights like Abraham
> don't get fought. Abraham might well grow out
> of the division without being fought by Pavlik if
> they don't make that fight by years end.
>
> Pavlik / Hopkins was a shutout even if a showcase
> for Bernard at his best. There are better contests
> to be seen at middleweight......we just haven't
> seen them.
>
> --
> http://therealnews.com/t/
>
> --
> Edited by JimEarl at 05/31/2009 10:11 AM PDT
I think your missing my point Jim. In the past decade or two, boxing has fallen out of the mainstream's eyesight. Now, MMA has become successful, even less people care about boxing. While defending a title is a good thing, its not what gets casual fans excited. Kelly Pavlik could have fought Abraham, Sturm, and every other middleweight contender out there, and he probably wouldn't have even made SportsCenter. By fighting B-Hop, he got his name out there in there. Had he been successful, I'm sure he could have gotten another siperfight with Calzage, and he would have become a star in a sport that starving for stars. Pavlik has his entire career to defend the middleweight title, but he only had a small window of time to become a star. He failed, and now he still has his title to lean on. I have no problem with that.
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Re: Kelly Pavlik's opponents
May 31, 2009 3:49 AM
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> Mundine will get WBC and WBO ratings as of early
> next month, taking over Geals.
>
And Mora miraculously disappears from their
top ten.
> Likely he is now fighting Kelly instead of Mora.
>
> The fight will explode. As soon as Mundine runs his
> mouth off. This is a big fight. And a tough opponent
> for Kelly. Although he should prevail.
I'm actually looking forward to this one as I
know this guy will get the fans attention for
the fight if it actually comes off as you seem
to think.
However:
The most likely scenario that I'm reading so far
Has Mundine fighting Felix Sturm in Germany
But If you're right, Kelly fights a very close fight
until a late round KO.....maybe
--
http://therealnews.com/t/
--
Edited by JimEarl at 05/31/2009 12:53 AM PDT
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