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Well here we go with a baseball thread for all. I have some opening thoughts, but everyone feel free to chime in. Pitchers and catchers in two days.
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8,577
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(10483 of 10513)
Nov 10, 2009 2:30 PM
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> i like it when they tell the driver to save the tires
> and conserve fuel, but go a little faster! LOL!
There you go.
So what am I supposed to make of the radio conversation with Button?
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Posts:
8,577
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(10482 of 10513)
Nov 10, 2009 2:26 PM
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> he got the car from honda and the engine from
> mercedes, but other than that, he did it all himself.
> i got it.
No, you don't GOT IT.
Honda, as does everybody in Formula 1, develops their cars using super computers. Only after testing is done using computer modeling is done is a test car then built. The test cars are designed to be modified easily in the field. As such, they are compromised as race cars. After all the testing is complete, the race cars are built using the data from the tests.
Honda (with Ross Brawn running the team) did the development work on the computers and built a testbed car. AFTER Honda transfered ownership of the team to Brawn were more test cars built AND then the race cars built.
It was also Brawn that had to modify the cars to accept the Mercedes engines as you don't think Honda designed them to accept them do you?
>
> i guess the in season upgrades didn't work out to
> well. how many races did button win in the second
> half of the season?
Are you also talking about the races that Reubens won and all the podiums?
And it's not as though the other teams stood still.
Look at what Red Bull, McClaren, and Force India did.
> i know what goes on. i read all the magazines and
> watch all the same shows you watch. i've sen the
> machine shops and the wind tunnels and the ovens
> where they mold the carbon fiber. it could show a
> lack of knowledge on your part about what really goes
> on in NASCAR though.
NASCAR hasn't changed since the 70s. And they still use parts from the 60s.
You are a fan and see things from a fan's perspective. Nothing wrong with that.
I'm not a fan in the same sense as you are of either Formula 1 or NASCAR. What I find interesting and what attracts me, you find boring.
I'm very well versed in NASCAR, the cars, the...."technology", etc. I'm also versed in the politics that drive it. These are aspects that you find boring and don't interest you.
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Posts:
11,088
Registered:
11/1/01
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(10481 of 10513)
Nov 10, 2009 2:17 PM
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> How many times this season (and the ones before) have
> we heard some guy over the radio telling their driver
> to pass the guy in front as though saying it makes it
> happen?
i like it when they tell the driver to save the tires and conserve fuel, but go a little faster! LOL!
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Posts:
8,577
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(10480 of 10513)
Nov 10, 2009 2:12 PM
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>
> on the radio they were telling button and barichiello
> that that the only faster car out there was
> hamilton's. does your knowledge run deeper than
> theirs too?
And you have been watching?
How many times this season (and the ones before) have we heard some guy over the radio telling their driver to pass the guy in front as though saying it makes it happen?
A team certainly won't tell its drivers that their car is slower than the other guy.
&> there's a new car coming out next year. i think that
> shutting down development of the current car hurt
> them, but hopefully they put the extra time on the
> new car to good use.
McClaren has a new car coming out, too and they have the more powerful Mercedes engine. Brawn also has increased technical assistance from Mercedes next year and a new car that improves on their current front running car. And Red Bull may be getting Mercedes power as well and they presently have the best car.
I'll wait until winter testing.
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Posts:
8,577
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(10479 of 10513)
Nov 10, 2009 2:06 PM
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> Nino,
>
> Why are some of the top car companies ending their
> participation? Is the cost more than any reward?
It depends on which company and what their reason for participating was.
Honda got out when Formula 1 dropped their races in North America, their biggest market. Honda instead increased its participation in both the IRL and the American LeMans series where it won the LMP1 championship.
Toyota is leaving because of finances and because without Honda to compete against, there is no marketing value in their home market in Japan.
BMW is leaving because of lack of success. As the company that stresses the engineering prowess of their cars, their lack of success in Formula 1 reflects negatively on that.
Renault is contemplating leaving because their reputation has suffered as a result of the race fixing scandal earlier this year. Couple that with the bad economic times and the decision becomes easier.
Overall, the manufacturers are disturbed over regulations that limit high technology and development of both cars and engines. There are pending regulations that will cap costs and allow parts commonality in areas such as brakes, shocks, wheels, etc. There are also efforts to make the various engines equal in power output. A manufacturer that wants to showcase their technology in Formula 1, will find the series less interesting if all these measures take place.
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Posts:
11,088
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(10478 of 10513)
Nov 10, 2009 1:32 PM
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> Apparently her driving skill isn't all you're making
> it out to be as the IRL teams are not signing her and
> letting her go to NASCAR.
who has more money? i never said anything about her driving skill other than stating what her record was.
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Posts:
11,088
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11/1/01
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(10477 of 10513)
Nov 10, 2009 1:29 PM
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> Apparently your definition of "not much different" is
> MUCH DIFFERENT than the rest of the world (it must be
> the bizarro world view).
you represent the world now? LOL.
> The Brawn car was developed by Honda during the
> previous season. Honda also gave Brawn the money that
> it would've spent in Formula 1 for 2009. Brawn then
> secured a customer engine deal from Mercedes. Brawn
> still had to BUILD the car and make all the parts for
> it. Brawn also did the in-season development and
> built all the parts for the upgrades.
he got the car from honda and the engine from mercedes, but other than that, he did it all himself. i got it.
i guess the in season upgrades didn't work out to well. how many races did button win in the second half of the season?
> I'm sorry, but I do feel this shows a lack of
> knowledge on your part to what really goes on in Formula 1.
i know what goes on. i read all the magazines and watch all the same shows you watch. i've sen the machine shops and the wind tunnels and the ovens where they mold the carbon fiber. it could show a lack of knowledge on your part about what really goes on in NASCAR though.
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Posts:
11,088
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(10476 of 10513)
Nov 10, 2009 1:23 PM
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> The Red Bull was also the better car on that day. The
> Red Bull dominated all weekend.
>
> Schumacher wouldn't have been able to pass Webber.
on the radio they were telling button and barichiello that that the only faster car out there was hamilton's. does your knowledge run deeper than theirs too?
> > > I see that now Alonso is your boy, huh?
> >
> > he's on my team. i think with the new car,
> alonso and
> > massa, SF has to be the favorite next year. i
> did
> > like the ice man too though. too bad it didn't
> work
> > out in the end.
>
> Why the favorite?
>
> Ferrari didn't show anything this season that would
> automatically make them the favorite.
>
> The Ferrari engines are down on power vis-a-vis the
> Mercedes engine, and it seems as though the directors
> of the team are also a bit lacking. And while Alonso
> is a very good driver, I don't think that it is a
> coincidence that he's been involved in the two
> biggest scandals that has hit Formula 1. Also,
> Ferrari is losing their favorable relationship with
> Bridgestone.
there's a new car coming out next year. i think that shutting down development of the current car hurt them, but hopefully they put the extra time on the new car to good use.
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Posts:
2,659
Registered:
3/2/06
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(10475 of 10513)
Nov 10, 2009 12:45 PM
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Nino,
Why are some of the top car companies ending their participation? Is the cost more than any reward?
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Posts:
8,577
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(10474 of 10513)
Nov 10, 2009 12:39 PM
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> but did you watch it? that's always seems to be the
> issue. the last 20 laps button was trying
> frantically and furiously to overtake
> webber...couldn't do it.
The Red Bull was also the better car on that day. The Red Bull dominated all weekend.
Schumacher wouldn't have been able to pass Webber.
>
> > I see that now Alonso is your boy, huh?
>
> he's on my team. i think with the new car, alonso and
> massa, SF has to be the favorite next year. i did
> like the ice man too though. too bad it didn't work
> out in the end.
Why the favorite?
Ferrari didn't show anything this season that would automatically make them the favorite.
The Ferrari engines are down on power vis-a-vis the Mercedes engine, and it seems as though the directors of the team are also a bit lacking. And while Alonso is a very good driver, I don't think that it is a coincidence that he's been involved in the two biggest scandals that has hit Formula 1. Also, Ferrari is losing their favorable relationship with Bridgestone.
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Posts:
8,577
Registered:
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(10473 of 10513)
Nov 10, 2009 12:33 PM
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> I like all car racing but F1 is boring because too
> many times if you qualify 1st and win the race to the
> first turn, it's over.
It has to do with track design.
They've all become "Tilke dromes"
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Posts:
8,577
Registered:
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(10472 of 10513)
Nov 10, 2009 12:31 PM
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> like i said, not much different. definitely cooler,
> but not much different in its goals. how much could
> brawn actually have done in the little time they had?
> i saw peter windsor talking about where he was
> s buying engines, brakes, etc.
Apparently your definition of "not much different" is MUCH DIFFERENT than the rest of the world (it must be the bizarro world view).
The Brawn car was developed by Honda during the previous season. Honda also gave Brawn the money that it would've spent in Formula 1 for 2009. Brawn then secured a customer engine deal from Mercedes. Brawn still had to BUILD the car and make all the parts for it. Brawn also did the in-season development and built all the parts for the upgrades.
I'm sorry, but I do feel this shows a lack of knowledge on your part to what really goes on in Formula 1.
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Posts:
8,577
Registered:
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(10471 of 10513)
Nov 10, 2009 12:25 PM
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> if you generate enough revenue to pay for yourself,
> you're not overpaid. but even using your faulty
> reasoning, coming in 5th out of 20something isn't
> midling, is it? she's always in the top ten, even
> when she was on rahal's team.
Well, it isn't certain that she is paying for herself.
In her time in the IRL, there has been no evidence that she has helped increase its popularity. In fact, TV ratings and attendance at IRL events are down substantially. The only event that shows a marginal increase with her participation is the Indy 500. Apparently her driving skill isn't all you're making it out to be as the IRL teams are not signing her and letting her go to NASCAR.
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Posts:
2,659
Registered:
3/2/06
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(10470 of 10513)
Nov 10, 2009 11:16 AM
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> > I like all car racing but F1 is boring because
> too
> > many times if you qualify 1st and win the race
> to the
> > first turn, it's over.
>
> it woulda been fun if dale sr. was in there! lol!
He was great to watch. I don't know what's wrong with Jr. He has won 16 or 18 races so he must be able to drive and he has Hendrick's backing.
I have a friend who has been involved is Nascar all his life, from being Dick Trickle's crew chief years ago to working for Jack Rousch now and he swears it's 80% the car and 20% the driver, obviously among the top 15 or so drivers.
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Posts:
11,088
Registered:
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(10469 of 10513)
Nov 10, 2009 10:59 AM
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> I like all car racing but F1 is boring because too
> many times if you qualify 1st and win the race to the
> first turn, it's over.
it woulda been fun if dale sr. was in there! lol!
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