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My Homework assignment #37 for Professor Gordo

[Replies: 9]
Homework assignment #37 ? Read Kael?s piece concerning Cary Grant?s sex appeal; compare and contrast Kael?s explanation with your own observations on Gabriel Byrne?s secret mojo.

Dear Professor: First let me confess that due to my on-going Attention Deficit Disorder that first revealed itself in the wake of my recently developed Byrnemania, I was, in fact, unable to read the entire Kael article. I know that this revelation is likely to result in my paper receiving a less than stellar grade, but I think its best to be honest before we begin. I will say that I did carefully read the first few paragraphs, then skimmed over the next 2345 pages, stopping along the way when I caught an idea or theme that I deemed relevant. So, I?ve written my observations below and captured some quotes that I believe highlight Grant?s similarities to Byrne as well as some that demonstrate their differences.

To begin, I believe that Kael?s comments about shyness, reserve and unavailability being among Grant?s strongest attributes, are points that come closest to being applicable to Gabriel Byrne. Kael writes:

?The little bit of shyness and reserve in Grant is pure box-office gold, and being the pursued doesn't make him seem weak or passively soft. It makes him glamorous--and, since he is not as available as other men, far more desirable. He draws women to him by making them feel he needs them, yet the last thing he'd do would be to come right out and say it. He isn't weak, yet something in him makes him hold back--and that something (a slight uncertainty? the fear of a commitment? a mixture of ardor and idealism?) makes him more exciting.?

But there are some ideas in the statements above that I?m not sure really apply to Gabriel Bryne. I concede that shyness and reserve are certainly Byrne traits, but I am not as comfortable with the phrase, ?the last thing he?d do would be to come right and say it?. I need to think about that one. On the one hand Paul Weston was guilty of holding back such admissions but that was due to professional constraints and in the end, he couldn?t hold them back forever. Furthermore, Gabriel Bryne, doesn?t strike me as someone that would hold back such feelings if they were there. He strikes me as someone that would wear them reluctantly, sadly blazing on his sleeve. He strikes me as someone that is incapable of hiding his caring or passion, even if it flies in direct conflict with the Irish-boy shyness he?s never outgrown.

In addition, some of his other comments about Grant only dance around explaining Byrne?s sexuality. They come close but they don?t quite hit the mark because, while Grant may share some of the qualities that we see in Gabriel Bryne, the two men are not exactly alike. Now Gordo please understand, I don?t know much about Cary Grant so I could be completely off base here, but I remember Grant being cool, debonair and funny. And as I read Kael?s article, he makes reference to Grant?s sexy-yet comedic persona several times.

?What makes Grant such an uncannily romantic comedian is that with the heroine he's different from the way he is with everybody else; you sense an affinity between them. In "The Awful Truth," he's a hearty, sociable businessman when he's with other people, but when he's with Irene Dunne you feel the tenderness that he conceals from others?..
The only trace of gloom in Grant's movies is in "None but the Lonely Heart," which he made in association with Clifford Odets (as writer and director) in 1944. The film was an ironic interlude in Grant's career, coming, as it did, between the cloying whimsey of "Once Upon a Time," in which he was a Broadway sharpie exploiting a boy who had a pet dancing caterpillar, and "Night and Day," the ten-ton Cole Porter musical bio, in which he skittered about as a youthful Yalie before facing life with stoic courage and inscrutable psychic hangups.?


Kael appears to be making the point that this type of role becomes Cary Grant?s trademark. Likewise, Byrne has a blistering sense of humor to be sure and he has been cast in some cool, debonair, even slightly comedic roles such as his End of Days Satan character. But for the most part, Byrne?s sensuality bubbles up from a sadder place, a more vulnerable place than I see in Cary Grant. Byrne can break your heart with just a hint of his sad crooked smile, whereas, Grant wins you over with a lighter hearted kind of sexiness.

Finally, I think Grant and Bryne both come off as well-read, intelligent men that appear to appreciate the deeper qualities of women while still being interested in their physical attributes. As Kael writes, ?With Grant, the social, urban man, there are infinite possibilities for mutual entertainment. They might dance the night away or stroll or go to a carnival--and nothing sexual would happen unless she wanted it to? This is definitely a Bryne characteristic. I could envision spending entire evenings with GB, just discussing favorite authors or observations on Ireland or America. And yes both of Grant and Byrne avoid demonstrating oversexed neanderthal male aggression qualities, instead preferring to sit back and wait for the inevitable moment when the woman begs to be conquered.

?Cary Grant is your dream date--not sexless but sex with civilized grace, sex with mystery?.Grant doesn't assert his male supremacy; in the climax of a picture he doesn't triumph by his fists and brawn--or even by outwitting anybody. He isn't a conqueror, like Gable. But he's a winner. The game, however, is an artful dodge. He gets the blithe, funny girl by maneuvering her into going after him. He's a fairy-tale hero, but she has to pass through the trials: She has to trim her cold or pompous adversaries; she has to dispel his fog. In picture after picture, he seems to give up his resistance at the end, as if to say, What's the use of fighting??

So professor, that?s my opinion of the similarities and differences of Cary Grant vs Gabriel Bryne. I do hope that before you mark up my paper with your red pen you will at least stop to consider my state of mind when I wrote it. I had, after all, just watched ?A Dangerous Woman?. In light of that fact, its really remarkable that I was able to concentrate on this assignment at all.

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Edited by TouchedByThPoet at 04/15/2008 10:48 AM PDT

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Edited by TouchedByThPoet at 04/15/2008 1:22 PM PDT
Last Post Apr 18, 2008 3:36 PM by: TouchedByThPoet
Posts: 1,741
Registered: 3/19/08
(10 of 10)

Re: REPLY From Prof Gordo: A-

Apr 18, 2008 3:36 PM
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> TBTP:
>
> It's well done, that comparison between GB and Grant
> and your dissenting opinion . . . as far as you went.
> Alas, not far enough. No one, least of all,
> , expected that you or anyone would find Pauline
> Kael's insights to parallel exactly yours or anyone's
> into GB's charisma.
>
> Take care: hard to say how much longer I'll be around
> here, or for that matter, how much longer the site
> will be open.


Will they close these forums at some point in the near future really?
Posts: 154
Registered: 2/23/08
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REPLY From Prof Gordo: A-

Apr 18, 2008 3:17 PM
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TBTP:

It's well done, that comparison between GB and Grant and your dissenting opinion . . . as far as you went. Alas, not far enough. No one, least of all, expected that you or anyone would find Pauline Kael's insights to parallel exactly yours or anyone's into GB's charisma.

You do express yourself with commendable clarity and effective writing, just as --- it was clear form our earlier exchanges --- that you are an unusually intelligent person. All traits that can't be emphasized too much.

When you get around to it, read the rest of the Kael piece and see --- assuming this site is still open --- whether you might not find other nuggets buried in her racy prose.

Keep in mind too: despite her large influence, her unique writing style as a film critic, her wide-ranging cultural savoir-faire, she did not win unanimous acceptance in many circles --- alas, very small in number these days --- of other, equally cultiated, and equally bright film reviewers. The classic piece, a put-down, appeared by Reneta Alder in the New York Review of Books, around 1982; and more recently by Louis Menard, who writes a lot for the New Yorker magazine, maybe three or four years ago.

Take care: hard to say how much longer I'll be around here, or for that matter, how much longer the site will be open. And yes, I very much appreciated your feisty attitude. I had to struggle hard to provoke others into more than a few workds of "dump!" or "sickie pedant" in order to find something to get my teeth into for my own purposes.

Best,
Michael: AKA, click here: the buggy professor
Posts: 1,741
Registered: 3/19/08
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Re: My Homework assignment #37 for Professor Gordo

Apr 15, 2008 10:47 PM
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> > He aint Gab...can you feel me?
>
> Oh I feel you. Gabe he aint.
>
> My younger sister happens to love Johnny Depp. She
> thinks he's a great actor, gorgeous, sexy as hell,
> etc. She'll often joke when she sees him that
> "there's my next husband" or something of that
> nature. Yes, she enjoys his movies, seeing his face
> on a magazine cover but never has she acted in ways
> that I have about our Glorious Gabe or felt compelled
> to. No googling, no excessive viewing, nothing of
> that sort. So ... he might be sexy (and I think he
> is a very handsome and sexy man) but he doesn't seem
> to have the mojo to inspire women the way the
> Glorious G does.



Well it is funny because before In Treatment, I would have probably...god this is going to sound awful, but I would have probably said Johnny Depp...was...sexier than Gab.

I know, bite my fucking toungue.

But, I've said plenty of times that IT put me over the cliff with Gab in a way that I had not been before.

Furthermore, I would have to say Johnny Depp might be second on my list of sexy men...but...its a very very distant second. With Johnny, there is no obsession. Just an observation. He's a sexy sexy pirate, and a worthy actor. But my thoughts about him just pale in comparison to my thoughts on our boy.

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Edited by TouchedByThPoet at 04/15/2008 7:48 PM PDT

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Edited by TouchedByThPoet at 04/15/2008 7:49 PM PDT
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Re: My Homework assignment #37 for Professor Gordo

Apr 15, 2008 10:38 PM
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> He aint Gab...can you feel me?

Oh I feel you. Gabe he aint.

My younger sister happens to love Johnny Depp. She thinks he's a great actor, gorgeous, sexy as hell, etc. She'll often joke when she sees him that "there's my next husband" or something of that nature. Yes, she enjoys his movies, seeing his face on a magazine cover but never has she acted in ways that I have about our Glorious Gabe or felt compelled to. No googling, no excessive viewing, nothing of that sort. So ... he might be sexy (and I think he is a very handsome and sexy man) but he doesn't seem to have the mojo to inspire women the way the Glorious G does.
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Re: My Homework assignment #37 for Professor Gordo

Apr 15, 2008 10:05 PM
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> Professor Touched, I doff my hat to you. Excellent
> commentary. You have such a beautiful way of writing
> and getting to the heart of the matter. Clear,
> concise and always entertaining.


Gee thanks MS. To be honest this subject is a bit dry to me but Gordo seemed to think it important that we read and comment. I gave it my best. I hate to admit to being so shallow but honestly its really hard to read abou 14 pages on Cary Grant when you dont have a "jones" for the man. I've seen him in a few old movies and recognize that he's a sexy man but...this is way before my time and I just dont have an internalized attraction to him.

On the other hand, there are other men that Gordo rambles on about, like Johnny Depp that I think are positively delicious. I really think Depp is sexy as hell

BUT....

Once again...I've never even dreamed of "googling" Johnny Depp. I've never, until now, written one word about Johnny Depp. Sexy pretty man with devastating cheek bones but....

He aint Gab...can you feel me?
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Re: My Homework assignment #37 for Professor Gordo

Apr 15, 2008 9:05 PM
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Professor Touched, I doff my hat to you. Excellent commentary. You have such a beautiful way of writing and getting to the heart of the matter. Clear, concise and always entertaining.
1974rn
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Re: My Homework assignment #37 for Professor Gordo

Apr 15, 2008 8:05 PM
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Per Kael's Cary Grant piece:

Grant could glide through a picture in a way that leaves one indifferent, as in the role of a quaint guardian angel named Dudley in the bland, musty Goldwyn production "The Bishop's Wife" (1947)

Clearly the author's opinion..
And we know that opinions are like butts, everyone has one....
It happens to be the very vehicle that caught this poster's eye re: Grant as an actor. His portrayal of an angel sent to earth to help a Bishop, and in the process, dare I say it, falls in love with the Bishop's wife. Kael discounts Grant's role in that movie akin to posters here, who are clearly unable to fathom GB's appeal to us, his steadfast masses.
To each his own..
1974rn
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Re: My Homework assignment #37 for Professor Gordo

Apr 15, 2008 7:56 PM
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Per Kael's piece concerning Cary Grant -

Grant is a comic master at throwaway lines, and he turns them into a dialogue, as if he were talking to himself

I would say that GB is the master at throwaway LOOKS and boy, oh, boy does he turn them into dialogue...talk to us, GB baby....:-p
1974rn
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Re: My Homework assignment #37 for Professor Gordo

Apr 15, 2008 7:51 PM
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Wallowing our way thru Kael's LONG piece on Cary Grant, Killer's eyes fell upon something that he must address:

Cary Grant's romantic elegance is wrapped around the resilient, tough core of a mutt, and Americans dream of thoroughbreds while identifying with mutts.

Killer SNIFFED out that somewhere in all of this ceaseless rambling, there was a reference to a dog...bark, out...
P.S. Dame says this would apply to GB as well, as he is a bit of a mutt and a mug, and GOD, ya gotta love 'im....
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My Homework assignment #37 for Professor Gordo

Apr 15, 2008 1:42 PM
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Homework assignment #37 ? Read Kael?s piece concerning Cary Grant?s sex appeal; compare and contrast Kael?s explanation with your own observations on Gabriel Byrne?s secret mojo.

Dear Professor: First let me confess that due to my on-going Attention Deficit Disorder that first revealed itself in the wake of my recently developed Byrnemania, I was, in fact, unable to read the entire Kael article. I know that this revelation is likely to result in my paper receiving a less than stellar grade, but I think its best to be honest before we begin. I will say that I did carefully read the first few paragraphs, then skimmed over the next 2345 pages, stopping along the way when I caught an idea or theme that I deemed relevant. So, I?ve written my observations below and captured some quotes that I believe highlight Grant?s similarities to Byrne as well as some that demonstrate their differences.

To begin, I believe that Kael?s comments about shyness, reserve and unavailability being among Grant?s strongest attributes, are points that come closest to being applicable to Gabriel Byrne. Kael writes:

?The little bit of shyness and reserve in Grant is pure box-office gold, and being the pursued doesn't make him seem weak or passively soft. It makes him glamorous--and, since he is not as available as other men, far more desirable. He draws women to him by making them feel he needs them, yet the last thing he'd do would be to come right out and say it. He isn't weak, yet something in him makes him hold back--and that something (a slight uncertainty? the fear of a commitment? a mixture of ardor and idealism?) makes him more exciting.?

But there are some ideas in the statements above that I?m not sure really apply to Gabriel Bryne. I concede that shyness and reserve are certainly Byrne traits, but I am not as comfortable with the phrase, ?the last thing he?d do would be to come right and say it?. I need to think about that one. On the one hand Paul Weston was guilty of holding back such admissions but that was due to professional constraints and in the end, he couldn?t hold them back forever. Furthermore, Gabriel Bryne, doesn?t strike me as someone that would hold back such feelings if they were there. He strikes me as someone that would wear them reluctantly, sadly blazing on his sleeve. He strikes me as someone that is incapable of hiding his caring or passion, even if it flies in direct conflict with the Irish-boy shyness he?s never outgrown.

In addition, some of his other comments about Grant only dance around explaining Byrne?s sexuality. They come close but they don?t quite hit the mark because, while Grant may share some of the qualities that we see in Gabriel Bryne, the two men are not exactly alike. Now Gordo please understand, I don?t know much about Cary Grant so I could be completely off base here, but I remember Grant being cool, debonair and funny. And as I read Kael?s article, he makes reference to Grant?s sexy-yet comedic persona several times.

?What makes Grant such an uncannily romantic comedian is that with the heroine he's different from the way he is with everybody else; you sense an affinity between them. In "The Awful Truth," he's a hearty, sociable businessman when he's with other people, but when he's with Irene Dunne you feel the tenderness that he conceals from others?..
The only trace of gloom in Grant's movies is in "None but the Lonely Heart," which he made in association with Clifford Odets (as writer and director) in 1944. The film was an ironic interlude in Grant's career, coming, as it did, between the cloying whimsey of "Once Upon a Time," in which he was a Broadway sharpie exploiting a boy who had a pet dancing caterpillar, and "Night and Day," the ten-ton Cole Porter musical bio, in which he skittered about as a youthful Yalie before facing life with stoic courage and inscrutable psychic hangups.?


Kael appears to be making the point that this type of role becomes Cary Grant?s trademark. Likewise, Byrne has a blistering sense of humor to be sure and he has been cast in some cool, debonair, even slightly comedic roles such as his End of Days Satan character. But for the most part, Byrne?s sensuality bubbles up from a sadder place, a more vulnerable place than I see in Cary Grant. Byrne can break your heart with just a hint of his sad crooked smile, whereas, Grant wins you over with a lighter hearted kind of sexiness.

Finally, I think Grant and Bryne both come off as well-read, intelligent men that appear to appreciate the deeper qualities of women while still being interested in their physical attributes. As Kael writes, ?With Grant, the social, urban man, there are infinite possibilities for mutual entertainment. They might dance the night away or stroll or go to a carnival--and nothing sexual would happen unless she wanted it to? This is definitely a Bryne characteristic. I could envision spending entire evenings with GB, just discussing favorite authors or observations on Ireland or America. And yes both of Grant and Byrne avoid demonstrating oversexed neanderthal male aggression qualities, instead preferring to sit back and wait for the inevitable moment when the woman begs to be conquered.

?Cary Grant is your dream date--not sexless but sex with civilized grace, sex with mystery?.Grant doesn't assert his male supremacy; in the climax of a picture he doesn't triumph by his fists and brawn--or even by outwitting anybody. He isn't a conqueror, like Gable. But he's a winner. The game, however, is an artful dodge. He gets the blithe, funny girl by maneuvering her into going after him. He's a fairy-tale hero, but she has to pass through the trials: She has to trim her cold or pompous adversaries; she has to dispel his fog. In picture after picture, he seems to give up his resistance at the end, as if to say, What's the use of fighting??

So professor, that?s my opinion of the similarities and differences of Cary Grant vs Gabriel Bryne. I do hope that before you mark up my paper with your red pen you will at least stop to consider my state of mind when I wrote it. I had, after all, just watched ?A Dangerous Woman?. In light of that fact, its really remarkable that I was able to concentrate on this assignment at all.

--
--
Edited by TouchedByThPoet at 04/15/2008 10:48 AM PDT

--
Edited by TouchedByThPoet at 04/15/2008 1:22 PM PDT