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Hi friends. By the way, I am gratefull to all you who so generously have contributed your time so that I can enjoy IT even more. Thanks Livvy, Babeeblues, Paxon2, Jolie, everyone! Thank you!
Another one:
Before Laura/Season-1 vanishes from our memories completely? At the time I was just discovering IT and I really did not pay as much attention as in season2; even deleted whatever I had from season-1 off my DVR? but I am still curious about it.
I remember quite a bit, but not clear on the entire thing... so what better place than this one to go over it? (smile)
LAURA/SEASON-1:
I remember that Laura lost her mother at a young age (14, 15?). Her father was depressed and she had to take care of him for a year or so, and apparently this was very hard on her. At some point she went away and lived with a married couple for some time?a summer I believe...
- I am not sure if am confusing it with Sophie?s story here ?
But I believe Laura was attracted the husband of the couple, but never were more than friends. Years later (don?t recall exactly the length) She did have a sexual affair with the guy when he came to her area on business of some kind and then went to visit her at her fathers home and had dinner with them (I don?t recall the city).
The guy became a regular at the house and during this time they did have a sexual affair. I am not sure if this was her first sexual experience but apparently it was important in her life, some how? I believe Laura said to Paul in one of the sessions that she seduced the guy (.. not sure here...), but Paul was railing her about the guy taking advantage of a situation because he was much older than her and in doing so, damaged her somehow.
Ok, so that is what I remember? So please set me straight. I would like to know the following:
In general: What exactly was the problem with Laura?
-What precisely brought her to Paul? How did she choose Paul? (yellow pages, a recommendation?)
-Why and when did she get so hooked on Paul? (Unlike Mia, I don?t recall she was lonesome? So what was she trying to fill in her life with Paul?
-We know that Paul liked her a lot (could we say in love with her?). Why?... was it just physical attraction? Or just his desire to ?rescue? her?
-Finally, if you can pinpoint what her ?problem? was? Was it resolved? I know she decided she had enough of therapy? that she was finally convinced Paul did return her affections and decided to move on... Then, the miracle of miracles? Paul went to her house to love her? but then he had the anxiety attack and well, he left? And that was it ! ????
My only conclusion here is their romance was simply a case of "mutual transference?" Although I never heard this conclusion anywhere... Because for two people who were so "crazy" about each other - in their own way - isn't it strange that neither one has ever tried contacting the other one?
Does that make sense?????
EL
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(17 of 47)
Re: ...and what about LAURA, still curious - help :)
Jul 6, 2009 10:40 PM
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If there is a season three I pray they some how write Laura back into it... She was such a mess.
I hear you, Gruffy, but after Paul's emotional evolution in season two, I suspect that Laura thing is a bell one can't unring. Paul is no longer who HE was from season one....it would smack of hasty recycling to try to rekindle the Laura dalliance on the writers' parts.
BUT, I'd take a recycled Laura over this Wendy mention. Please, please, please not Wendy. Let Paul run into Samantha from Sex And The City....now THAT'S a coupling that would move Paul from stodgy to sizzling....hahahahha.
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(16 of 47)
Re: ...and what about LAURA, still curious - help :)
Jul 5, 2009 6:41 PM
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I had a chance to watch an episode of Laura (episode 3) today when I was working out and when I watch those two, (Paul-Laura) I'm just blown away about how great that relationship really was...so intense and a tremendous connection. Immature, yes but intense and real. No floating through there, they were like gasoline and a match, one little spark and BOOM! They are still my favorite part if IT.. nothing in season two came anywhere close to it. We all think Paul is the key to IT, but from my view...Paul, Laura and Gina are IT...the threesome, made season one...without Laura, it just didn't work for me.....If there is a season three I pray they some how write Laura back into it... She was such a mess. Paul couldn't help but fall for her, with his loving and caring manor. She really needed him and as it turned out....he needed her. I will always believe Laura loved Paul in her own way, the only way a girl like Laura can love someone.
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(15 of 47)
Re: ...and what about LAURA, still curious - help :)
Jul 4, 2009 10:28 AM
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> Yes, yes and yes, LL. All of what you said. But wow,
> we are still debating this over a year after the
> season ended!!! Although I loved Season 2, no
> similar issue engaged viewers in that way at all.
>
> --
> Edited by lauriejoan at 07/03/2009 8:20 PM PDT
Bingo Bingo and Bingo Lauriejoan...NO SIMILAR issue engaged viewers that way in Season 2....
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TouchedByThPoet
http://sites.google.com/site/touchedbythpoet/Home
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(14 of 47)
Re: ...and what about LAURA, still curious - help :)
Jul 3, 2009 11:18 PM
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Yes, yes and yes, LL. All of what you said. But wow, we are still debating this over a year after the season ended!!! Although I loved Season 2, no similar issue engaged viewers in that way at all.
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Edited by lauriejoan at 07/03/2009 8:20 PM PDT
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(13 of 47)
Re: ...and what about LAURA, still curious - help :)
Jul 3, 2009 6:48 PM
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You think she won't cheat oh him if they become a couple or marry? I think she would, plus I just didn't get that nurturing instinct from her. I think if Paul had a tragedy in his life, she would start to see him as a "dark place" in her life, like her father was.
You know, Neek, I think deep down inside, Paul knew that, hence his hasty departure from Laura's bedroom last season. He didn't let his love overrule his sense....rare, rare occurrence with men, but there are some out there, like Paul, who stand at the edge of that precipice, looking down into the swirling eddies in the abyss of love/lust and decide to listen to that voice in their head screaming, "RUN!!"
Of course, I wonder how much Paul was terrified of letting Laura see the real person he is....hot mess and all? Would he have run the risk of revealing his emotional wreckage and thus no longer being her hero anymore? Could he tell that Laura didn't have the stuff to bolster him for the long haul?
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(12 of 47)
Re: ...and what about LAURA, still curious - help :)
Jul 3, 2009 4:34 PM
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When he is 70 Laura will be 39/40 (or close enough given the time difference between season 1 and season three - (staying positive guys!)
You think she won't cheat oh him if they become a couple or marry? I think she would, plus I just didn't get that nurturing instinct from her. I think if Paul had a tragedy in his life, she would start to see him as a "dark place" in her life, like her father was.
I would like to see her brought back to reslove it. Maybe they will "get it on'" but then he realizes he was just needing sex and nothing else...lets face it, he was thinking about sex ALL the time, and only got it once a month form Kate. No wonder he got caught up with and adoring female..half his age.
Maybe he will have established a solid relationship with Wendy? I would love to see them explore the Supervisor angle though, oh the possibilities, and it would mean they could definitely bring back Gina.
But whatever the writers want to give us I will accept with glee, just as long as we get a season three!
IT has given him visibilty, and definitely upped his "power" meter..he can get the things done that he wants to get done by being the Golden Boy..go for it Gabriel!!
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"Hello? ...your dorwer wz open"
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(11 of 47)
Re: ...and what about LAURA, still curious - help :)
Jul 2, 2009 5:55 PM
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During the first 2 seasons of IT, Paul wasn't happy. He was stressed about his family and patients. I wish that we could see him happy in a third season of IT. I would like to see a real relationship with him and Laura. I think it's time for Paul to be happy because we haven't seen that.
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(10 of 47)
Re: ...and what about LAURA, still curious - help :)
Jun 1, 2009 7:41 PM
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I feel like the "Laura" storyline was left incomplete. I hope that the character will be back before the show ends. I really want to see what 's going to happen with Laura and Paul. Maybe he'll run out on her again like he did when he went to her house.
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(9 of 47)
Re: ...and what about LAURA, still curious - help :)
Jun 1, 2009 1:02 AM
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Elrico, as usual, you ask good questions and I appreciate your kind remarks and your own keen insights.
I very much want to jump into the discussion, but it may be a little while more before I manage.
I can say, generally, that, yes, your desription of what happenened struck me as largely accurate. As ITFan says, I believe (and maybe others as well), we hear that Laura came to Paul at the recommendation of her fiance, Andrew, with whom she splits before week 4 or 5.
In general, I believe I more or less agree with most of ITFan's post. You may find discussion on some threads from the archives last year rewarding, enlightening. But I am very interested in matters you focus on and want to respond.
I don't know that there is one "right" answer on everything. There are answers which may be problematic, dubious, inaccurate, or resting on questionable premises. I think you're right that sometimes things may not all add up because even with a show as rich and stellar as IT, not everything withstands heightened scrutiny. But because IT is as good as it is, by and large, I do want to credit what's presented to us. As you, I want to make as much sense as I can, draw, learn, as much as I can from what it presented to us. Along, of course, with the many keen insights and different perspectives shared here last year and now this year.
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(8 of 47)
Re: ...and what about LAURA, still curious - help :)
May 31, 2009 5:46 PM
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People please, I can't believe all of you are as confused as I am. So please help us out! - I even have a suggestion: As a forum dedicated to IT, we should have a SUMMARY of all the cases from both seasons, DON'T YOU THINK? We could have two of three slightly different conclusions if needed, but we should have something!
ITFAN, KarenWeston, MissPDX, KatieDorr,
I have read all your responses and I appreciate them because I really want to understand this episode. The episode seems complex and I find myself climbing up one of those steel towers (like those water tanks towers), in order to get a better perspective of the ground below (smile)
At this "height" I am wondering about the writers themselves. In fact more than that actually... I am wondering what is the goal of a writer and this is the key to all this exercise: Should we strain ourselves to find the answers to this episode in the context of the shows? Or? is the actual plot just left to our interpretation or speculation.
Which is it?
I would think, any writer for this kind of material (tv or moves) would want to tell a story, as interesting as possible yes (using all the techniques we know they employ) but ultimately have a "satisfied customer." And by "satisfied" I mean, a writer should want at least 70% of his audience to "get it."
One thing is to keep things interesting by keeping your audience guessing and another to keep them in complete "limbo." And what writer proud of his craft would want this? No, I would think the game is simpler than that. The writer plays with our interest, clues maybe hidden under a word or sentence somewhere in the dialogue... But the clues MUST be given and it's up to us to find them and put the puzzle together.
If I were a writer for IT, given that the nature of the subject is complex enough, I would expect a portion of my audience not to "get it" the first time or none at all. Let's be generous? Say only 70% of the people should "get it" the first time. Others, less gifted ? like Elrico (smile) ? may not get it on a particular episode ? Laura in this case ? But surely, he should get it with help of some of the bright people in a forum like this one, dedicated to understanding IT.
CorrectoMundo? (smile)
Ok, this is what we have so far from all the responses. Please CORRECT if any of my assumptions are incorrect.
-My original plot was very accurate (none one has disputed the basic plot so far)
-We concluded that Albert, her boyfriend or fiancé at the time, was the one who suggested Paul to Laura. She has been in therapy for at least 14 months, (considering she has "loved" Paul for at least a year, 12 months). Now, even 12 months of therapy (12x4=48 sessions) it's quite a bit of therapy and so it is reasonable to assume, Laura had a serious problem. The question is WHAT?
-Albert was in fact a shrink himself, I believe I remember Laura making fun of Albert as being "not too bright of a therapist." (Yes / No?)
-------------------------
-KarenWeston says:
When we first saw Laura she had already been seeing Dr. Weston for almost a year.
-I believe her problem was connected to:
-her mother dying when Laura was young
-her father became depressed when his wife died
-her brother was away at college
-she felt all alone in the world
-the lawyer manipulated her into thinking she seduced
him while he was staying with Laura and her father just outside of Washington,D.C.
the lawyer came to D.C. because he was working for
someone who had a big case being ajudicated in
D.C.
I would add two more points: Yes, Laura felt all alone as KW says. In addition to that, Laura hat to "take care of his father" when he was depressed. And as Paul experienced the same thing with his mother, this is something very hard on any kid and likely to affect him badly.
-------------------------
Another issue was a "trust" problem. Apparently Laura had problems trusting men? I think I remember Paul in a session saying that her father "did not protect her" when the lawyer was having sex with her in their home. That the father somehow chose to "ignore" what was going on and left her unprotected.(Yes / No? ? Not sure about this part.
Again the whole issue of WHY Laura needed therapy is still a mystery to me. Unlike Mia, we know nothing about her younger years. We know that was an MD and that she was about 30 years old or older? (don't recall)
-Was her mother and father for that matter "normal" parents to Laura?
-Were they affectionate with her?
-What about boyfriends when a teenager? (I don't remember anything on this...)
-At what age did her mother die? And was she sick for a long time before dying? How long?
-And was Laura her only caretaker?
-Was her father helpful and competent before his wife?s death?
But SOMETHING must have happened that screwed her up so bad
-----------------------
Oh yes one more thing (Per ITFAN)
You asked earlier if Paul was trying to rescue Laura? I think, it was Laura trying to rescue Paul....Laura once told Paul she saw him as someone who was dead ( I forget the exact words she used but she insinuated that Paul was not experiencing life to it's fullest). She felt , in many ways, she brought him back to life. Many will say she was manipulating him, that it was just a game for her, but I see it quite differently than most. I think Laura really did have genuine feelings for Paul. In many ways, she knew Paul better than he knew himself. How often was that confirmed later in his sessions with Gina?
It is easy to see how two attractive people like this can get "tranfered" themselves to one another (smile) in the midts of some much intimacy. I believe Laura fell in love with Paul geniunely (Just like Mia) and saw Paul as her "perfect guy." On the other hand, although most think that Paul loved Laura too (he said so many times)... I wonder why after a long while of not taking to each other, why haven't either one attempted to talk? There is no more The-Patient realtionship to worry about... seem strange...
EL
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Edited by Elrico at 05/31/2009 3:20 PM PDT
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(7 of 47)
Re: ...and what about LAURA, still curious - help :)
May 31, 2009 1:54 AM
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Whatever the reason, it was quickly subsumed by erotic transference. This is why I would never go to an attractive male therapist. I would probably spend the 50 minutes trying to break down his boundaries, and the original issue would remain unresolved, if not forgotten entirely. he he
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(6 of 47)
Re: ...and what about LAURA, still curious - help :)
May 31, 2009 1:03 AM
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When we first saw Laura she had already been seeing Dr. Weston for almost a year.
I believe her problem was connected to:
her mother dying when Laura was young
her father became depressed when his wife died
her brother was away at college
she felt all alone in the world
the lawyer manipulated her into thinking she seduced
him while he was staying with Laura and her father just outside of Washington,D.C.
the lawyer came to D.C. because he was working for
someone who had a big case being ajudicated in
D.C.
basically, she was living by herself and here comes this good-looking lawyer that she had lived with a few months earlier
at the last minute she changed her mind about sex with the lawyer but she didn't have enough strength, confidence and courage to make him stop
No, she was not cured. But she was in better shape than when she started therapy.
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(5 of 47)
Re: ...and what about LAURA, still curious - help :)
May 30, 2009 11:05 PM
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Just testing...
I want to put a LINK to IT in wikipedia but I don't know how...
Nice tables of IT in Wikipedia
Let's see if it works..
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(4 of 47)
Re: ...and what about LAURA, still curious - help :)
May 30, 2009 10:46 PM
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Hi ITFAN and MissPDX. Thanks for your input so far
>In general: What exactly was the problem
> with
>Laura?
>
> EL- It depends on who you ask...many people see this
> differently. For example, you ask a psychotherapist,
> he/or she might say she was borderline. You ask a
> guy who just broke up with his girlfriend, he might
> say she was a b----, you ask someone who had similar
> experiences, he/or she might say was ashamed, and
> suffered from low self esteem. No one can say with
> exactness what Laura's "problem " really was.
Well I am glad I am not the only one who does not see it cleary... I am a little 'dense' sometimes, but I guess these episodes are not so easily understood unless you are a Physotherapist... Then again, I would think the writters would want us 'regular people' to understand the episodes hmmmm.
> boyfriend/fiancee might have known him. But that
> doesn't necessarily mean he referred her.
Yes, we got one... Andrew is her boyfriend's name per MissPDX, and I believe I remember when Laura told Paul that "Andrew was pleased she was seeing Paul. So we the the who, now we need the WHY? (smile)
COME ON PEOPLE... JOIN THE FUN!... JUMP IN (smile)
> attraction? Or just his desire to ?rescue? her?
>
> I can only speculate here, but I think Paul did
> love her. I think tranference is in everyday
> life, and many relationships and marriages are
> formed, as a result of some degree of transference.
> Regardless, if Paul had slept with Laura while he
> was her therapist... he would have been recreating
> her past. Where someone with power, she loved and
> trusted harmed her. In the end, I think he
> recognized this.
Well, yes, one thing we know about Paul, he is ethical... Even though he has been tested... He does put the interest of the patient aheah of his own needs... The way it should be from a professional therapist.
You know, I have been looking on the Internet for something like "In-Treatment, Laura, summary" or a combination like that... and so far nohting really.
I did find a nice table in Wikipidia
EL
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Edited by Elrico at 05/30/2009 7:48 PM PDT
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(3 of 47)
Re: ...and what about LAURA, still curious - help :)
May 30, 2009 10:17 PM
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I can't say for certain, but I think her boyfriend/fiancee might have known him. But that doesn't necessarily mean he referred her.
Her boyfriend Andrew referred her to Paul.
>
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Edited by MissPDX at 05/30/2009 7:17 PM PDT
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